National Asset Transfer Action Group minutes: May 2023

Attendees and apologies

Attendees:

• Kathleen Glazik (Chair), Community Empowerment, Scottish Government
• Malcolm Cowie (Secretariat), Community Empowerment, Scottish Government
• Christopher Robb, Community Empowerment, Scottish Government
• Rebecca Carr, Forestry and Land Scotland
• Sandra Holmes, Highland and Islands Enterprise (online)
• Linda Gillespie, Community Ownership Support Service
• Julia Rolim, Community Ownership Support Service
• Max Steele, Property Division, Scottish Government
• Iain Mulholland, South Lanarkshire Council
• Lee Haxton, Perth and Kinross Council
• Pauline Bradshaw, Glasgow City Council
• Colin Love, South Ayrshire Council
• Sandra Inrig, Renfrewshire Council   

 

Apologies:

• Dave Thomson, Community Land, Scottish Government
• Maureen Burgess, Fife Voluntary Action
• Angus Hardie, Scottish Community Alliance
• Rebekah Dundas, Scottish Land Fund
• Brian Paton, Edinburgh City Council
• Helen Emery, NHS Highland
• Jillian Matthew, Audit Scotland
• David Mitchell, Property Division, Scottish Government

Items and actions

Welcome and Introductions

The Chair welcomed everyone to the first in person meeting of the National Action Group. Welcomes were extended to Iain Mulholland, South Lanarkshire Council, James Gardner, Perth and Kinross Council, and Danielle Clark, Scottish Water, who were attending their first meeting of the group. Introductions were also made to Jill Keegan, standing in for Angus Hardie, Scottish Community Alliance, and Marco Meoni, for David Mitchell, SG Property Division. Julia Rolim, Community Ownership Support Service attended the meeting in her role as data analyst for the Community Empowerment (Scotland) Act 2015 review of Part 5, asset transfers.

Apologies were noted.

Papers were shared with group members and invited attendees prior to the meeting including a discussion paper, and an overview list of appeals to Scottish Government, which was for the purposes of this meeting only.

 

Minute of Last Meeting

The minutes of the last meeting held on 4 August 2022 were agreed and have been published on the National Asset Transfer Action Group

 

Update since last meeting

An update was provided on changes to Ministerial portfolios following the appointment of the new First Minister and Cabinet. Humza Yusuf has been appointed First Minister, with Shona Robison, Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Finance. Asset transfer policy remains with Tom Arthur, now Minister for Community Wealth and Public Finance.

The Chair provided an update on work undertaken across Scottish Government in support of the Community Empowerment Act Review:

Part 1 National Outcomes - A consultation for the statutory review of the National Outcomes has been launched in March (14 March 2023) and is open until 5 June https://www.gov.scot/publications/national-outcomes-review-2023-consultation-information-pack/

Part 2 Community Planning - The Local Government Housing and Planning Committee are continuing their post-legislative scrutiny of Part 2, community planning, and are also scrutinising Part 9 Allotments. Their work and findings will help inform the wider Community Empowerment review.

Part 3 Participation Requests – The Community Empowerment Team are working with the Scottish Community Development Centre (SCDC) to look at how part 3 is working, including exploring the viability and need for a possible appeals mechanism, and community workshops are planned for August/ September to gain local views. The team are also working with Glasgow School of Art Innovation School to carry out interviews with those involved in the participation request process, and also to look at the data gathered from public service authority annual reports.

Part 7 Football Clubs – policy team are exploring a Fan Bank and there should be an announcement soon. The Fan Bank is planned as a funding source to help fans groups purchase a share in their local sports club, i.e. it supports community ownership. It will most likely be football fans groups that use this resource, but there’s no reason why it could not be used by other sports groups.

The Chair asked the group for any significant updates from their areas, and key points are:

• As part of a consortium led by Locality, DTAS has been successful in gaining the contract for the support element of the UK Government Community Ownership Fund. The Scottish element of the fund is approximately £12.5 million and includes post-acquisition development funding up to £250,000 for community groups.
• COSS also updated on Church of Scotland plans to rationalise their estate. Over the next 5 years, 35-35% of their estate will be sold, which will be of interest to local community groups.
• COSS are receiving 85-90 new clients per year into their service.

 

Presentation: Review of Part 5 of the Community Empowerment (Scotland) Act 2015 – an update on progress since August 2022

Malcolm delivered a presentation to the group on actions undertaken since the last meeting in August 2022, focusing on work to progress the review of part 5 (asset transfers). This included a summary of actions by the Community Empowerment Team, which also included engagement with colleagues across wider policy teams concerned with the Community Empowerment (Scotland) Act 2015.

During the last year the Community Empowerment Team has gained updates on policy colleagues activity to progress their individual parts of the review/ Act; work carried out by the Community Empowerment Team to engage with legal and analytical colleagues for advice on part 5 legislation; and work to progress the Ministerial appeals and review processes.

Malcolm also highlighted plans to host community workshops on part 5 legislation in conjunction with COSS this year, and the first of these is to be held in Dumfries on Thursday 8th June.

A conversation followed, and capacity issues were discussed. Issues remain around capacity building, and the joint SG/COSS pilot in Barmulloch, Glasgow, and Inverclyde is exploring ways to support capacity building. Learning from this two-year pilot will help inform the findings of the Community Empowerment Act Review.

Action: Group to send further suggestions for the purposes of the review of part 5 to Malcolm.

 

Open discussion session

The Chair introduced the session and encouraged open discussion around the following three key themes. Papers were circulated prior to the meeting to help facilitate these discussions:

• The current list of 95 relevant authorities for the purposes of asset transfer.
  • Does the list (circulated separately) need updated? Any relevant authorities to be removed/ added/ name amended?
• The asset transfer appeals and review process.
  • Current timescales for appeals: is 20 working days enough time for community transfer bodies to submit an appeal to Scottish Government?
  • Do we need to change anything relating to appeals?
• Good Practice in asset transfers.
  • How do relevant authorities further embed ease of process and transparency for community organisations accessing asset transfers?
  • We know that a Single Point of Contact at the relevant authority is an effective way of supporting asset transfers. How can we encourage further use of this?

It was agreed that the list of 95 relevant authorities (taken from schedule 3 of the Community Empowerment (Scotland) Act 2015) would benefit from updating to reflect the current situation. Some organisations have changed their name, and some colleges have changed their organisational structure following alignment to Universities. Some organisations may need added to the list following conversations with those organisations concerned. Some organisations may benefit from clarity of function and organisational structure to ensure they are transparent and are adhering to the requirements of the legislation.  

Action: group to consider other named organisations to be added to the current list of relevant authorities.

Action: Words to be drafted for updated Scottish Government statutory guidance to reflect authorities for the purpose of asset transfers e.g. including arm’s length executive organisations. Community Empowerment Team and COSS to take this forward initially.      

On appeals and reviews to Scottish Government, it was agreed that the findings of Reporters reports should be shared widely, so the learning from these can be made available to all those involved in the process. Scottish Government post these reports on conclusion of each appeal and review, and they can be accessed here:

Asset transfer requests: index of notifications

Some issues were further explored, including considering social value, demolition of an asset while interest in an asset transfer is ongoing, the need for transparency in the appeals process, and the sharing of good practice on decision making in the asset transfer appeals process (for example Forestry and Land Scotland’s developed processes). 

Regarding good practice (and adhering to the requirements of the Act), the group considered an update to statutory guidance on the use of a Single Point of Contact would be helpful, to establish and encourage further. A conversation followed on the limits of Scottish Government scope, and what could be done to further promote and champion good practice locally.   

Action: Malcolm to check current statutory guidance, and group to consider wording to be used in updated guidance.

 

Any other business

The group were asked to consider any other people who might wish to join the National Asset Transfer Action group, and to signpost them to Malcolm for a conversation if interested.  

 

Date of next meeting

September and date to be confirmed.

The next meeting will provide an opportunity to build on these conversations, and to look at other parts of asset transfer legislation in the context of the review. An update on annual reporting for asset transfer (due 30 June 2023) will also be provided.