Single Scottish Estate: Delivery Board minutes - August 2024

Attendees and apologies

• Scott McEwen, Head of Property Services, Scottish Government
• Michael Walker, Senior Finance Business Partner, Scottish Government
• Ian Bowie, Senior Policy Officer, Scottish Government
• Neil Milligan, Principal Estates Surveyor, Scottish Government
• Kirsty Lamb, Project Manager, Scottish Government
• David Lyon, Data Co-Workstream Lead, Scottish Government
• Fiona MacDonald, Programme Manager, Scottish Government
• Gordon Alexander, Estate Strategy and Planning Advisor, Scottish Government
• Scott McQueen, Public Bodies Strategic Lead, Scottish Government
• Luke McGuire, Data Co-Workstream Lead, Scottish Government
• Barbara Crowe, Business Manager, Scottish Government
• Paula Fearn, Principal Estates Surveyor, Scottish Government
• Stewart Christie, PCS Group Vice President, Scottish Government
• Chris Keay, Head of Security and Business Continuity, Scottish Government
• David Milne, Team Leader - Public Service Reform, Scottish Government
• Graham Mitchell, Head of Technical Architecture, Scottish Government
• Lesley Price, Senior Estates Surveyor, Scottish Government
• David Johnston, Scottish Government
• Joseph Somevi, Senior Surveyor, Scottish Government
• some attenddees have been redacted

1. Apologies

 

• Marco Meoni, Senior Surveyor, Scottish Government
• Fiona MacDonald, Programme Manager, Scottish Government
• Lisa Goldie, Head of Programme, Investment and Supply Chain, Scottish Government
• Lynsey Morgan, PCS Group President, Scottish Government
• Scott McQueen, Public Bodies Strategic Lead, Scottish Government
• Kevin McGowan, Unit Head, Equality Division, Scottish Government

 

Items and actions

• Welcome and introductions

The Chair welcomed everyone to the meeting, and introduced DL to the Board, as one of two new Data Leads who will be working with the Programme.

• Minutes of last meeting and actions

The Chair highlighted those areas which he wished to draw to the attention of the Board.

PMO function – 4 contracts extended until March 2025, with 1 further person joining shortly.

• Property Controls – nearly completed. Finalising internal review. Next stage to extend it wider, and get more people using it. Chair will circulate a copy of the Property Controls to the Board shortly.
• Location Based Reviews (LBR) Perth taking a lot of work, but will shortly go to the Minister for agreement and then work with Perth and Kinross Council (PKC) and others. Aim is to co-locate to Pullar House, SMcE (Chair) GA IB PF SC NM DL CK KMF DM GM MW LP DJ  JS plus one other Perth with PKC. NM to give update on other LBR as a separate agenda item in the meeting. Once the Outline Business Case has been finalised, it will be shared with the Board for comment
• Web Pages New SSE webpages published on gov.scot. Independent website being developed.
• Ministerial Engagement Plan - Minister will attend the Forum in September.
• Risks – No changes from last meeting. Overall RAG rating Amber/Green.
• Data - Development of e-PIMs minimum data standard continues, as part of transition to InSite and support of SSE data requirements.
• Comms and Engagement – No further updates from last meeting.
• Glasgow Office Project (GOP) – currently in discussion with the Minister for Public Finance, will shortly be going to the Cabinet Secretary for Finance Ms Shona Robison on our recommendations.

Chair invited comments. It was noted that the Board should see how the projects have been linked together and on engagement with external stakeholders. The Chair noted that this was a very helpful comment.

• Project management office (PMO)

• Glasgow Office Project – support provided to allow business case to be presented to ET and to support ministerial submission.

• Perth – provided support on business case submission and stakeholder engagement.

• Training – PPM training is being scheduled for the end of September for all team members.

• Governance - A review will start shortly on governance in line with the Gate 0 recommendations. The following meetings have been scheduled:

• Advisory board – 28th August (subsequently postponed)

• Senior Stakeholder Group – 12th September (Mr McKee in attendance)

• Public Sector Forum – 17th September (Mr McKee in attendance)

Chair invited comments on the above – None

• Communications and engagement (Comms)

Key messages shared in the Pack sent to members for this meeting.

A question and answer document is in preparation, which will help to raise awareness of what the SSE involves and will be helpful for stakeholders.

Website specification is being finalised, which will hopefully include a members area for external stakeholders to have a private space for discussion. It will have a video with the Minister at the front to introduce the project to a wider audience. Finalising case studies.

Parliamentary Reception – planning for one later this year, hosted by Mr McKee.

Chair invited comments/questions on Comms – None.

• Location based reviews (LBR) – planning and progress

The Chair invited NM to give an update on LBR to the Board.

NB confirmed that a briefing paper had been circulated to Board members.

• Looks to identify what a LBR will look like, in best interests of Ministers.
• Make recommendations in line with aims of SSE.
• New Data Manager will look at data for LBR
• Hoped that by putting planning processes in writing will help stakeholders draw up a plan for their organisation (Inverness an example).

The Chair asked NB what he sees as the role of this Board in this work and what should be brought to the Board for approval. NB suggested that until we produce output and recommendations, it may not be of too much interest to the Board at this stage.

It was stated that Workplace Division is delivering on recommendations, and thus a key stakeholder. Hoping to see that stakeholders have been consulted, and able to deliver recommendations. Suggested that the Board should be informed of recommendations and how they were arrived at, and who has been consulted, and their interests have been considered.

NB said that when considering LBR, no one size fits all. We want to use a carrot rather than a stick approach. Ministers are putting financial challenge on all bodies, and we will need to adapt approach for each area of the country.

PF said she wished to understand the dynamic between the LBR and Property Controls process. NB said LBR reviews will be looking at costings, etc, Property controls will look at various bodies will have differing requirements. For example, some bodies will not have staff who are Baseline Security cleared, and that will potentially be a problem.

The Chair noted that DM would be leaving the meeting early and invited him to make any observations on what has been discussed. DM noted that the new Minister is taking a strong interest in how our Public Bodies reduce their corporate costs, and in releasing as much as possible for front line services In this connection the role of the SSE programme in releasing as much funding as possible for front line services. Public bodies are expecting continued pressure their own Minister on how they are reducing their costs.

• Single Scottish Estate (SSE) Scope

The Chair indicated that a discussion paper shared with the Board prior to this meeting, and welcomed the Board members views.

The paper explained the different roles between the different SSE Boards (Advisory, Governance, Project Delivery Board etc).

Chair invited discussion of what the focus of the SSE, and specifically this Board, should be including how savings and efficiencies are made clear. The Chair asked if Board members were clear on actions for the SSE programme. It was noted that LBR’s are linked to the Scottish GOvernment (SG) estate and would like to see what others are doing. It was indicated that they would come back with further comments on the paper circulated.

The Chair noted the SG is a significant part of this and recognised those bodies that are under the SPFM will get Ministerial direction. However, the scope could go out wider and recognised that NHS is doing good work in this area. All bodies within public sector are considering similar issues, although in different ways. Suggested the Board should have this discussion at next meeting on how we get those other bodies involved in the discussion to get the external perspective.

Personal reflections that members receive from other boards, which they feel are not being received within this board, are welcomed here.

GA commented that a business case for the programme will help to define the scope, aware this is being developed. The Chair said that once scope has been considered again, along with the review of governance, matters will be clearer and needs to be proportionate and appropriate.

CK commented that it is clear from reading the paper, that it would not be appropriate at this stage to massively increase the scope to cover all the public sector as well as the SG Core Estate and a choice for the Ministers to make. The Chair noted all the points and agreed needs to be clear in the business case.

• Any other business

The Chair thanked all for their participation, and confirmed the next meeting would take place on Wednesday 30th October at 14.00 – 15.30. Location to be confirmed.