Social Security Experience Panels - Seldom Heard research programme: wave 2 report

Annex E: Main challenges concerning specific sub-groups

The reports of the first wave of the Seldom Heard Voices research programme showed the main challenges and enablers for each specific group of the mobile populations strand, carers and care experiences strand and vulnerable groups.^[13] Similar findings have been found for those specific groups in the second wave. However, frequent barriers and enablers of new specific groups interviewed in wave two were identified and they are presented below.

Prisoners

Re-offending and financial hardship

Many prisoners have experiences of drug addiction and destitution.^[14] Most prisoners mentioned that a key reason for re-offending was not having any financial support just after being released and people could not cope with the changes of being out of prison immediately. Many said that the waiting period to access benefit payments and services after being released was the cause for committing a crime again.

“I’m concerned for the people in here because often they get out of prison and they don’t have help to know what to do. And they might be able to claim for something to help them, but they are left waiting 6-13 weeks to get a payment. It’s like a revolving door in here. I’m in four and a half years so I’m seeing who comes and goes. Many have good intentions when they leave, but then it hasn’t worked out. They got to a point where they couldn’t cover costs and they turn to things like shoplifting and fraud. It’s triggered when there is a delay or a gap in something they should get through their benefits.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

“…those first few weeks are frantic, you are running about the place, you’re trying to get a roof over your head, you’re going to charities to help you, you’re dashing about. I couldn’t cope with that last time. A couple of weeks of that and I gave up. Much easier to get money through theft than wait for the benefits to kick in. I think about 90% of the prison population would agree with that unfortunately.” (Vulnerable groups strand, prisoner participant)

Some also provided further reasons for re-offending: experiencing benefit sanctions, not being able to access paid employment due to their criminal record and having poor literacy skills to complete benefit applications without support.

“I’m sat here in prison and I know quite a few people who can’t read or write. And they’ll just be let out and expected to be able to claim for benefits and fill in forms. They won’t be able to without help. For them committing crimes is the easy option, they don’t need to read or write to do that.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

“Being sanctioned meant I didn’t get any money for three months. And then I didn’t have any family and friends to turn to. So, I got back involved with crime, just to have money for food initially. But then you’re around drugs and I’ve had an addiction, so it sucks you back in. Especially if you don’t have a support network.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

Some mentioned that the wider context of people not being able to cover their basic needs as a reason to turn into petty crime such as shoplifting. A few also noted that some prisoners prefer to stay in custody as they feel their basic needs such as housing and food are covered.

“…for many of the guys in here it’s simply down to poverty. I see people come back in and they say to me that they are better off in here. It’s sad to think that for them to get a meal and a warm bed they have to come back to prison.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

“Since I have been working age the most comfortable I’ve felt has been when I’m in prison. And I’m sorry to say that. It’s like the better of two evils. I was always having to borrow money and getting into a vicious circle. In here I don’t need to worry about how I can live week to week…” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

Lack of awareness and communication channels

Many prisoners were not sure about which benefits they will be eligible once they are released. A few also felt anxious and stressed for the waiting period to get the benefit payment as they felt they will not have any other financial support after their release.

“But now I’m coming out I’m worried about money again. Because I don’t know what benefits I’ll get, how long for and then if there is a problem I could fall back into the crime and the drugs. I don’t want to but it’s a risk. It would be like history repeating itself.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

One barrier noted by a few was the lack of a mobile phone or a personal computer to be able to claim benefits or follow up benefit applications and processes. They also noted the potential issue of not having a permanent address required to start and follow up those processes.

“For anyone to contact me about a benefit claim when I get out that’s tricky. I don’t have a mobile or a computer. I don’t know what my address will be when I get out, I don’t know if they’ll be a landline where I’m staying. So how do you contact someone without an email, number or address?” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

Need for support prior and after release

A few recommended prisoners were provided support with benefit information and with application processes approaching their release. Many prisoners said if they could apply for benefits when being in custody, they could access benefit payments just following their release and hence avoid the waiting period and falling on financial hardship. A few also noted that getting benefit payments following their release could reduce re-offending.

“You need to be able to apply for benefits whilst you are in prison to get the ball rolling […] you should definitely be able to apply for benefits whilst you are in prison. That’s really important and we are saying that on behalf of everyone in here. Everyone would like to do that to avoid that gap when they get out.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

“It’s a worry sorting everything out when you come out. Last time I came out it was frantic with all the things to do. And if you can do something before you get out to set you up for when you get out that is a great help […] I’m worried about when I get out and not having benefits in place right away. I’m worried about applying and waiting for benefits. When you get out you have to sort housing, a bank account, bank cards, getting a phone so people know how to get in touch with you. You’re thinking about food. It’s a lot to suddenly do without support […] the thing about being able to do things whilst you are still in prison is that you could get things set up easily. If there were staff in the prison with the means and the role to help you with things like applying for your benefits online […] a lot of people are reoffending quickly because they get out and can’t cope right away. If you could have a safety net and something in place those first few weeks it would reduce re-offending.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

Some prisoners mentioned their need to access wider support once they are released. A few noted that this wider support needs to be linked with the social security system. They said that services they need included rehabilitation for addictions and services on training and employability.

“I’m on methadone and I need to go into rehab because I need a support system. It’s not just money, it’s a support system too. You need both really. […] skills and training are as important as money. The benefits system should not just think about money, it should be connected to things that help you get a leg up. There needs to be a connection between benefits and other things…when you sign up for Universal Credit you also can say if you are willing to sign up to employment support groups. But then those aren’t funded well. It’s just a tick box exercise at the moment. More needs to go into that wider support.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

“Social security should be a help to transition you. It is to carry you when you are in need. But it also needs help for training, to get into work. If there was more money put into those things fewer people would be on benefits, or they would be on them for less time.” (Vulnerable Groups strand, prisoner participant)

Survivors of abuse

Distrust of the benefit system

The survivors of abuse interviewed reported that going through the application and assessment processes made them feel anxious or in fear. They felt benefit staff did not believe or did not want to listen their experiences. They also felt they did not have any control of benefit processes and their outcomes. A couple of participants perceived benefit processes like a continuation of domestic abuse.

“…it was like the financial abuse part of it and I was like this is a way of them, in my experience, keeping that control there and that being continued. And it’s like I’d got out of the horrendous situation and now I’m out of it, I’m still being dragged through it. So, for me it was like, well it still is continuing abuse in my head and I can’t get out, I can’t navigate that away. I understand and I think that’s a fair analysis of when you’re in an abusive relationship or come out of one; your priorities are all over the place and it’s just one thing can kind of set you off. And for me that definitely was my experience of the current system. They didn’t understand. There was very little empathy […] I think it’s like continued control feeling. You can’t get away from it because not only have you come out of that relationship, you’ve now got a government body continuing control.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

“I don’t know how to put it but, like when I got for example my PIP letter back, which I got first before Universal Credit, they rejected me and they gave me a list of reasons why and half of the things I hadn’t even said and I just felt a bit like oh [sigh]. And then because I’d experienced domestic abuse and stuff and like all the gaslighting, I started doubting myself. And then that causes this whole thing in your head and so, yeah, it just [sigh] it was a bit of an ordeal…” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

Participants reported that the benefit staff asked specific questions to stop people making successful applications. A couple of participants mentioned that they avoided reporting any changes in circumstances or challenging the outcome of an application or medical assessment out of fear that their benefit payments may be reduced or stopped.

“In her opinion I could walk farther than what I told her. I could walk, basically and I’m like, ‘Well where’s you medical evidence for that, ‘cause I’ve got loads here that says I can’t, and that I’m in constant pain. Even walking under 50 metres is painful for me so I don’t know where you’re getting this.’ But sometimes they [advisors from support organisations] say it’s just not worth it. You can challenge it and lose everything, so I can’t see that I would but, it’s just stressful to go through it all.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

“…it definitely feels like it’s set up to catch you out […] And one of the things she asked me…like had I walked anywhere or had I seen any of [local area]. It was a very small sort of like conversation and I’d literally been out once and I said, ‘Oh yeah, I finally saw the sea the other day.’ And she made it into such a big deal; so I can’t possibly be depressed and stuff like that. And I just thought that’s so cheeky to like extend that bit of the conversation, but you can’t go into detail on the stuff I’m actually giving you information about. So, it definitely feels like it’s set up to fail.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

Lack of awareness of domestic abuse

All participants noted that applications were restrictive, complex and did not allow them to convey their circumstances. They felt their experiences of domestic abuse and their psychological, physical and financial consequences were not recognised when they were explaining them to the benefit staff.

“…and no flexibility, that was definitely one of my things. I just felt there was no deviation or understanding of a situation it was just one size fits all and that, that’s not the way that we should be going forward with […] the process that I went through was, was not very helpful at all. It was as I said. There was no understanding, it was just black and white it was either yes or no, there’s no in between. I felt like they were judging me when I would say things and then I would be penalised for it.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

One participant mentioned that when reporting a change in circumstances, benefit staff asked her to contact the abuser or the abuser’s family. She noted this experience as staff having a lack of understanding on domestic abuse.

“…it just shows that there’s just not much of an understanding there when what they’re asking you to do is not something that’s easy for people of domestic abuse situations. […] I don’t have contact with them. I don’t want to have contact with them, but they were making me go into a situation where I was gonna have to potentially do that and pull them back into a life that I’m trying to get away from. So, yeah it was horrendous, horrendous, when I think about it now… […] you’re asking me to speak to my ex partner [inaudible 0.41.05] that in a situation that we’re in right now and you know, there’s police involvement and I can’t do that.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

Essential need for support

All participants noted that when fleeing domestic abuse, women need support with getting information and application processes as the abuse had a negative impact on their mental health. They mentioned positive experiences in which workers from support organisations helped them with applications because they understood what they were going through.

“I couldn’t sit and fill out a form anymore which was frustrating and embarrassing and she [support worker] was, she was just wonderful. She helped fill out all the forms, she didn’t make me feel, she made me feel comfortable and like she understood and she was compassionate and took the time with you, not just trying to rush you through your appointment.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

A couple of participants also highlighted that information and evidence provided by support or advocacy workers on their behalf were disregarded during assessments. They suggested that evidence given by these workers should be considered. They thought support workers sometimes are in a better position to speak on their behalf about their experiences of domestic abuse.

“…when we went to the actual face to face interview, anything I said would be the only stuff that they’d write down. So she [support worker] wasn’t allowed to put anything across for my benefit and I, at the time my mind was so frazzled […] anything that she said couldn’t get taken into the statement, basically […] the reason why I brought this up in the first place was, she was allowed to go to my doctor and get information, she was allowed to go, so she gathered all the evidence for me ‘cause I couldn’t, I just couldn’t do it. She went to the council who were dealing with financial problems for me and she gathered information from them. She was like a little magpie collecting all the information for me. […] And so, if she’s allowed to go and get, gather information from my doctor, surely, she can speak on my behalf? It was just a weird thing to happen.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

All participants suggested the provision of training in how to support women experiencing domestic abuse for benefit staff and support workers. They highlighted the need to increase domestic abuse awareness, in particular among benefit staff who they felt did not recognise their experiences.

“…I think definitely understanding that these women aren’t lazy they’re traumatised, you know? And understanding the whole dynamics of it […] I definitely think a lot of training needs to be done in the benefits system on domestic abuse.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

“How can we pass a new domestic abuse act and not update the relevant support networks that are there for us?” It’s very like, not necessarily backwards but I think it’s like you can’t fix one thing without fixing all the other pieces […] like it is legislation [Domestic Abuse Scotland Act] so we should recognise, they should recognise that in a policy somewhere […] it helps to build confidence for us you know, to know that we can go competently to a new social security system. That we’re gonna be there to be supported and protected the way we should be.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

Participants suggested if information about their domestic abuse could be recorded within the social security system so whenever they need to communicate with staff, they avoid repeating their experience to different advisors or assessors. They also mentioned that recording this information regarding experiencing domestic abuse could also lead to signpost clients who are fleeing domestic abuse to other eligible benefits, services and support organisations.

“Not, you know, needing to tell her story a million times and having different reactions. It should just be, I’m a victim of domestic abuse or I’m a survivor of domestic abuse. […] We shouldn’t have to, you know, repeat it unless we need to, you know, for whatever reason. It should just be accepted […] It’s having that ability to express a bit of flexibility and express a bit of, “This is my situation, please have a little bit of understanding there.” (Survivors of Abuse strand, survivor of abuse participant)

Bereaved people

‘Tell us once’ service

Most participants used the ‘tell us once’ service to notify the death of their relatives to government organisations like DWP and Social Security Scotland. They were aware of that service through the registrar office, support organisations or their informal networks.

“When you register their death, there’s this ‘Tell Us Once’, and they just cancelled the housing and the benefits and things.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

Many mentioned that by using this service, the benefits claimed by their relatives were stopped and that was confirmed when they received a formal letter notifying the change. Some also noted that the ‘tell us once’ service provided them advice on what benefits they could claim in their current circumstances.

“… it was the Registrar who offered that they could do that thing where they tell people once, and then they let everyone know. So, they did do that. They let DWP know and then I got a letter through afterwards that they had been notified and that the benefits would stop.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

“It was actually when I went to register the death that they gave me like, I think it was a code. Because my husband was on sickness benefit at the time, and he’d only just really been awarded that, but it was really just to notify them to cancel his claim and from that information I was then obviously told what benefits I would be able to claim as a bereaved single parent.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

Most participants had positive views on that service as they perceived it as a simplified and efficient system. They mentioned that because of using it, they were able to focus on other tasks around the death of their loved one.

“I think it was easy that it was just one call that I had to make, and I didn’t have to call different departments to speak to people, so that works really well. When you have a bereavement or a death, you’re already needing to contact so many different people - funeral directors, family, and so it just made that whole part of my life easier.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

Interacting with support organisations and benefit staff

Many participants highlighted the help provided by support organisations for various tasks they had to carry out after the death of their loved ones. They gave them information about arranging the funeral, its costs and/or information about benefit entitlement. In some cases, they also gave them support by directly contacting government organisations and by completing forms.

“…Funeral Link [Dundee], they put me in touch with both DWP and Social Security Scotland and they helped me figure out whether or not I was eligible and whether or not I could claim and talked me through the funding that was available.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

Some participants stressed the relevance of having support organisations who were understanding of their bereavement experiences. A few noted their grief impacted their ability to carry out benefit processes and new arrangements so having the support of these organisations was essential for them.

“…I’m having days where I’m grieving, I’m trying to cope with the loss and my emotions and my health has gone downhill so badly since I lost [name] that even just answering the phone some days, I just can’t do it. […] My Macmillan workers have been great. Just, even when I didn’t want to phone up about money, [name of support worker] just had the most gentle persuasion, and she encouraged me with what I needed to do.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

“I just think it was really, really helpful to have Funeral Link. […] she was amazing at offering support and care and letting me ask questions and asking if I knew where to go for support. […] I don’t think I would have managed without them [Funeral Link] and got through it all.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

Some had to communicate directly with benefit staff from DWP and Social Security Scotland regarding the changes of their benefits. Overall, they highlighted that communication as positive.

“Getting information from the social security helpline quite early on certainly did help relieve that side of things - the stress and worry about money […] And, I would say that the phone call I had early on [after the death], that was really helpful because I didn’t think that I would be entitled to anything. […] They were very sympathetic and very understanding of what I was going through. They were actually really, really helpful and I got the impression that they were quite well trained[…] It was just one point of call that I had to make and just speaking to one person who was proactively giving me advice as to what benefits I could get or was entitled to claim. (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

“The contact I then had with Social Security Scotland was then quite a quick process and that was really helpful. (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

“What I would say is that they were very good, the social security, they did call me and make sure everything was alright and that all the money had been gotten and the funeral director paid and things. So, that was good - after the funeral.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

However, a couple of participants also noted the need for having staff who know more about bereavement and grieving. A couple also mentioned that having a face-to-face option to interact with benefit staff could help to get a more personal approach to people who are bereaved.

“Ideally, without the pandemic in the mix, if there was just a number and just a team that knew about terminal illness and death and afterwards, what people should do. That would probably be good for most people.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

“I think it probably would be better if you could see someone face-to-face because when you’re on the phone, it just feels rushed somehow. It’s like someone has just, how can I put this, it’s very impersonal and you feel like you’re just someone else that they [person on the phone] has got to deal with before they go on their break.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

A couple of participants suggested the need for a single point of contact in benefits agencies which could help to reduce the waiting period and to avoid repeating their circumstances again and again. This single point of contact could also help to signpost other services.

“The big thing is that it’s time consuming, and it’s frustrating, being passed from place to place. Even just having one person you can keep calling back instead of different departments and things.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

“I think as well, maybe if DWP or whoever you speak to on the phone if they could just point you in the direction of people like Cruse, or people like that who can maybe help with bereavement, that might be helpful too. I think that would make it a very human response as well.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

“I think the main thing is having a team that really just deals with terminal illness and linked benefits and bereavement. I think that’s the main thing that I would add is important.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

Benefit changes after the death of a loved one

Some participants were eligible for Funeral Support Payment. A few highlighted positive experiences with the process and described it as simple and easy to access. However, a few participants also mentioned their financial worries of not knowing the outcome of their applications due to the waiting times.

“I had one follow-up call, which was fine. But then I had quite a long wait to find out whether or not I would get it, maybe like a month. I know that maybe doesn’t sound like a long time, but when you’re talking to a funeral director, and you’ve maybe not paid them, it’s quite stressful. […]if they decide that they’re not gonna give you any help, it doesn’t leave you much time to try and find the money somewhere else.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

A few participants highlighted some benefit issues related with overpayments and passported benefits. One participant said that there was an overpayment issue in the account of her late relative which has remained unresolved. Other participant mentioned that as a child related benefit was linked to her late husband, that payment was stopped and that resulted on her not being eligible to a passported benefit that she and her advocate worker knew she was entitled to.

“There is a big outstanding issue for me with DWP regarding my mum’s death and benefits. And that all started when we discovered that my mum actually had quite a lot of money - it was quite a surprise really. […]The solicitor had said that they notified the DWP, but there’s maybe payments that have been made that shouldn’t have been made and we would need to pay them back. But, that’s over 9 months now and we’ve heard nothing. And seemingly, it can be over quite a few years before they do sort things like that. And it can be quite unsettling […] The solicitor has been in contact with DWP and she did say that there might be a delay because there is such a backlog. And, I did ask, “Normally, how long would it take?” and she said that it is just different for everyone - for some it could be months and for some it could be years.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)

“Well, obviously these grants are dependent on what benefits you’re on, and we were on child tax credits and so obviously, when my husband died, it seemed that they just went with him. So, I would just basically be left with nothing but I didn’t realise when I applied [for the child grant]. So, I got a phone call to say that I wasn’t eligible for the grant because my child tax credits had finished and that’s how I came to learn really. I was really shocked.” […] “So, I spoke to a benefits worker at Macmillan and she explained “Well, we’ll try and do a redetermination thing.” (End of Life strand, bereaved participant)