UNCRC Strategic Implementation Board minutes: September 2024

Attendees and apologies

• Ian Donaldson, Deputy Director (Deputising for Andrew Watson)
• Dragan Nastic, UNICEF UK
• Lucinda Rivers, UNICEF UK
• Juliet Harris, Together Scotland
• Amy Woodhouse, Parenting Across Scotland
• Eleanor Kerr, Healthcare Improvement Scotland
• Nicola Anderson, Scottish Courts and Tribunals Service
• Norma Ruettiman, Care and Learning Alliance
• Laura Caven, COSLA
• Jennifer Davidson, Institute for Inspiring Children’s Futures
• Craig Morris, Care Inspectorate
• Gina Wilson, Children and Young People’s Commissioner Scotland (CYCPS)
• Michael Cameron, Scottish Housing Regulator
• Andrew Montgomery, Social Security Scotland (Deputising for Helen Fogarty)
• Heather Robertson, Education Scotland (Deputising for David Gregory)
• CI Elaine Tomlinson, Police Scotland (Depuitising for ACC Catriona Paton)

Scottish Government supporting officials 

• Dean Snape, UNCRC Project Manager
• Andrew Preston, UNCRC Programme Assistant
• Liz Levy, Joint Unit Head, Children’s Rights Unit
• Joe Smith, Rights Reporting and Monitoring Programme Lead
• Paul Gorman, Empowering Children and Young People Programme Lead
• Lyndsey Saki, Embedding Children’s Rights in Public Services Programme Lead
• Rachel Cieciwa, Children’s Rights, Reporting and Monitoring
• Kavita Chetty, Deputy Director Human Rights Division and Mainstreaming
• Sarah Booth, Scottish Government Legal Directorate

Guests

• Charlie Fairley, Corra Foundation

Apologies

• Andrew Watson, Director for Children and Families
• Helen Fogarty, Social Security Scotland
• Laura Pasternak, Who Cares? Scotland
• Chloe Riddell, The Promise
• Ben Farrugia, Social Work Scotland
• Gita Sharkey, Joint Unit Head, Children’s Rights Unit

 

Items and actions

Welcome and apologies 

Ian Donaldson (ID) welcomed the Board and introduced himself. Apologies were given for those not in attendance.

Minutes and actions from previous meeting 

Dean Snape (DS) advised members that minutes of the last meeting were circulated on 2 July 2024 with no amendment requests received.

DS noted there were six actions raised at the June meeting and two outstanding actions from a previous meeting. All but one of these actions have now been closed as detailed within the action tracker circulated on 18 September 2024. The action which remains open is as follows:

• Lyndsey Saki (LS) to scope whether relevant organisations involved in early professional training could be added to the UNCRC programme update distribution list

This action is now in progress. Due to limited capacity within the team it had not been possible previously.

Highlight report 

DS reminded members that the Programme Highlight Report was shared with members on 18 September 2024. The report has been revised to capture all aspects of the new Children’s Rights Unit (CRU) business plan (BP). The BP was shared with members in draft at a previous meeting and then and approved by Ms Don-Innes. Within the Highlight Report it was noted that several projects have been paused as a result of recently introduced spending controls across the Scottish Government.

ID provided further clarification on the spending controls and their implications. The CRU hope that when spending controls are lifted some projects can be resumed and are considering alternative ways forward for others.

Juliet Harris (JH) commended the team for publishing the statutory guidance and CRWIA resources, noting that feedback from Together members has been positive. JH also noted concerns around delays to the interactive version of the Children’s Rights Skills & Knowledge Framework, stressing that members and broader stakeholders, particularly public bodies, are keen to see the framework released even if only in PDF format. She requested a timeframe for the release, noting that public bodies  are eager to use it to update their training materials.
LS clarified that she could not provide a definitive answer on the interactive version's release, however, it will not be possible this financial year due to spending constraints. The CRU is working on the PDF version now. There is a large number of resources to review. The CRU is aiming to have it ready by the end of the calendar year.

Dragan Nastic (DN) raised concerns about the decision to pause work to raise awareness of rights among groups most at risk of experiencing rights breaches. He asked if alternative ways forward were being explored to ensure this work does not stop entirely.
Paul Gorman (PG) clarified that the work to identify groups at risk is continuing. What has been paused is the creation of new resources for these groups. The ongoing focus is on utilizing existing resources creatively, rather than generating new materials. Liz Levy (LL) also highlighted that the Empowering Children and Young People team are considering how they can raise awareness by collaborating with organisations that work with children furthest from their rights. DN welcomed this approach.

Amy Woodhouse (AW) flagged the potential risks of pausing activities related to the Skills & Knowledge Framework, particularly when significant resources have already been invested. She recommended this be recorded in the risk register. She also inquired about the updated Parenting Leaflet, asking when it might be available.

PG confirmed that the leaflet is still being updated, though a planned consultation had been paused. The team hopes to publish it later this year.

ACTION: risk associated with pausing various activities to be considered for inclusion on the Risk Register

Support for public authorities on commencement

LS provided members with a brief update on the Innovation Fund, noting that it was launched to enable public authorities to embed children’s rights into culture, policy and practice. Eight projects were approved in September 2023. The decision-making process was informed by a diverse panel of young people who recommended the projects that they felt would have the most impact. The Corra Foundation supported this by working alongside Youth Scotland to shortlist recommended applications. A panel from SG, including representatives from the CRU and Promise team, reviewed the report produced by children and young people before making the final decisions from their shortlist.

The projects cover a spread of sectors including local government, justice, health and education. There is also good representation of groups whose rights are most at risk and across age ranges. The learning and outputs from the projects will form a key part of the broader UNCRC national improvement programme. That programme is focussed on sharing learning and practice to support public authorities in understanding the benefits of embedding a children’s rights based approach and how this contributes to other local and national strategic priorities. The funded projects will run up until December this year. Once complete, lessons learned from the creative approaches to embedding children’s rights will be shared.

LS introduced Charlie Fairley (CF) from the Corra Foundation to share an update on the successes and challenges encountered with the projects to date. CF started with a brief overview of the eight projects as follows:

• Fife Council is undertaking a range of ambitious and impactful initiatives including the co-design and development of a children and young people (CYP) charter, creating peer led ambassador programme for CYP and reviewing and implementing a comprehensive children’s service, participation and engagement strategy;
• Argyl & Bute Council aims to create and deliver an award scheme in co-production with CYP to motivate and recognise the progress of teams working to implement UNCRC principles across the council so the rights of CYP are respected;
• South Lanarkshire Council is supporting young people on the edges of care to determine the future of its Pathfinders programme.
• East Renfrewshire Council is working with disabled children, children with additional support needs and those living in poverty to participate in a new youth assembly. This will be a forum for consultation between children, senior council officers and elected members and will include a residential experience with activities;
• Scottish Borders Council is supporting a group of young people to undertake research as mystery shoppers to ascertain readiness of local organisations to implement the UNCRC. This includes training for young people and compiling a final report and feedback on the organisations success in implementing UNCRC
• Perth and Kinross Council is working with Families Outside to support CYP impacted by parents/carers arrested or imprisoned. They aim to embed an Impact Assessment Toolkit across organisations so that voices of CYP can be heard at every stage of the justice journey;
• Dundee City Council has worked with a variety of partner organisations to develop and deliver a ‘bonding with your bump’ initiative. This included supporting parents to take participatory approach to communicate with baby through song and speech;
• Western Isles Council is working with CYP from a range of different educational settings such as interrupted learners, Gaelic medium learners and asylum seekers and refugees, who have an increased risk of not having their rights fulfilled. This is supported by creative catalysts and educators to create a local curriculum that empowers and fulfils their rights.

CF told SIB that as part of participation in the fund, organisations agreed to two online learning exchanges. The first took place six months after the projects began. This provided an opportunity for groups to share updates on their projects, what has worked best and any issues they have encountered. For the next exchange operational staff will also be there to provide more insight.

Corra received six-monthly reports in March/April from organisations setting out progress to date. Final reports are due early 2025 once each of the projects have concluded. Overall, projects have been successful with 558 children supported to date. Only one council has had any issues around meeting intended outcomes, however, this was due to delays in recruitment of staff. Discussions have since been held on scaling down the project and to what can realistically be achieved.

Six out of eight projects noted unexpected challenges around timescales, staff retention and recruitment. There was also some challenge associated with covering large isolated areas making it difficult to engage with some CYP.

Some groups underestimated the amount of ground work and planning needed before projects began. On reflection, it was noted that having a longer lead-in time, so initial work can be done, would have been beneficial.

CF set out two major highlights so far. During the summer South Lanarkshire Pathfinders had a ministerial visit from Ms. Don-Innes, Minister for Children, Young People and The Promise. The young people  also interviewed the minister for a podcast and showed her a video they had produced.

Dundee City Council held a launch event at Dundee contemporary arts for the book they produced, Hello In There Wee One. The event was reported on STV evening news. Other groups will be hosting celebratory events towards the end of the year so there will be more opportunities for Corra to attend and provide further publicity about this work.

JH asked what steps are being take to capture learning from this work so it will have long-term strategic impact. CF responded that Corra have compiled a six-monthly report which will be followed by a final report once all projects are complete. He confirmed that whatever learning is gathered will be shared.

GW asked whether there was any plan to go back in a year’s time to assess the impact on how public bodies engage with CYP and whether they have improved the way they work. CF very much hopes to stay in touch with council representatives involved in the work. LS welcomed the suggestion and noted that the CRU would take on this action.

SG spending controls and impact

LL provided members with an update on the recent Scottish Government spending controls and how this has impacted on the CRU’s work for this financial year. It has been necessary to pause spend on seven projects as follows:

1. The development of the interactive digital version of the Skills and Knowledge Framework. It is hoped this can launch next financial year, subject to budget. In the meantime, a PDF version will be published.
2. Printing and distribution of the parents, carers and families booklet on children's rights. It is hoped this can happen next financial year, subject to budget, but in the meantime, it is available online.
3. Strengthening content on the ParentClub website and launching a social media campaign to help build parents' confidence in discussing children's rights issues. Again, this will be picked up next financial year, subject to budget.
4. Recruiting a PhD intern to scope the development of indicators for articles 37 and 40. Scottish Government analysts will make a start on this instead.
5. Commissioning a review UK Acts in devolved areas. The decision to pause was not just budget related - it was decided it would be sensible to await the outcome of discussions with the UKG around extending protection for children’s rights in Scotland. The outcome of those discussions could mean that re-enacting legislation as Acts of Scottish Parliament may not be necessary.
6. Developing more targeted resources for listed authorities, however the CRU are considering what support can still be provided that does not require additional funding.
7. Targeted awareness raising on children's rights among those furthest from their rights. The CRU is exploring how they can do that through organisations that work closely with these groups.

Jennifer Davidson (JD) asked whether, as the funding situation changes, any thought had been given to how to inform prioritisation/sequencing of bringing these projects back. LL noted that she is not yet clear on the budget for next year so will have to make decisions once that is confirmed however collaborating with stakeholders/SIB on this would be helpful if decisions about prioritisation are required

DN queried whether the spending controls would have an effect on the CRU as a whole and whether officials might be moved to other posts. LL confirmed there is currently no intention to change and officials will remain in post. DN went on to congratulate the CRU on the work that has been done in relation to Children’s Rights and Wellbeing Impact Assessments (CRWIAs) noting that he had seen figures on how many SG officials had now been trained on conducting them and how many CRWIAs have been published. He queried whether this training would continue and whether CRWIAs are published in one place where they can be viewed. LL confirmed that CRWIA training is to continue, and she is looking to create even more capacity within the unit for this.

ACTION: LL to share with SIB a link to the  page for published CRWIAs

Gina Wilson (GW) noted that it was great that there were positive lines of communication with UKG around UNCRC Act limitations but queried when conversation might reach a point at which options will be clearer? LL advised that this work is led by colleagues in the Directorate for Constitution and timescales are not yet certain.

JH noted that Together’s members are very keen for this UKG-SG work to progress. While they are keen to see key pieces of legislation being re-enacted in a way that brings them within the scope of human rights legislation, they would prefer for the Scotland Act to be amended so that the UNCRC Act could apply across all devolved areas. LL confirmed that SG shared that aspiration.

Terms of Reference / Future of SIB

ID noted that the UNCRC Strategic Implementation Board (SIB) has currently been in place six months beyond the date agreed in Terms of Reference (ToR) and that many key milestones have passed. As such, it feels like an appropriate time to consider the ToR for the group and its purpose as we move beyond these milestones.

Across Children and Families Directorate (DCAF) there are many stakeholder groups, with a resulting risk of fragmentation, duplication or confusion about roles. SIB has been an example of a group that has worked well over the last 3 years, from SG’s perspective. It is a constructive forum in which to have discussions and has achieved the tasks set out in the ToR.

LL added that over the course of the last three years, as well as adding rigour to programme governance and reporting, the CRU have also found SIB a helpful place to test thinking before putting advice to Ministers on aspects of the Bill and programme of work.

LL put five questions to members to consider:

1. What have you found helpful about being part of SIB? In what way has it helped you in your own professional role? 
2. The Children's Rights Scheme is where Scottish Ministers will set out the arrangements that they've made, or propose to make, to ensure that they comply with the compatibility duty and to secure better or further effect of the rights of children. The Children's Rights Scheme will be overseen by the Children's Commissioner, SHRC, Together, UNICEF UK and children and young people. Is there still a role for SIB to help ensure that decisions about our programme of work are taken in a proportionate, effective, balanced and transparent way?
3. Does SIB require a role in identifying what further relevant support needs to be made available to public services or is the Board comfortable that this is done by the Embedding in Public Services Reference Group? Does SIB have any recommendations about how membership of that group could be strengthened? 
4. SIB is focused on the projects that the Children's Rights Unit have been leading or co-ordinating but there are a wide range of other organisations that are doing important work to embed children's rights. Are there members of SIB who would want to join a group to hear about the need for any further support to public authorities and work collaboratively to offer that?
5. Is there any other function that we have not discussed that would require the SIB terms of reference to be redefined?

ID invited initial observations/response to these questions.

DN noted that he is retiring at the end of the week however it was a great privilege and honour to be involved in SIB and that no other country in world is doing as much as Scotland to embed the UNCRC. . He further noted that the UNCRC Act was the beginning of a journey and there will be a continued need for a space like SIB to bring partners and stakeholders together to ensure that the legislation is properly implemented, especially in the current fiscal situation.

Eleanor Kerr (EK) explained that SIB helped to explain hold-ups, which could be fed back to her organisation. It also helped in her national inspection role of children's services. However, she noted the existence of other groups added to the blurring of roles, so maybe there’s no need for SIB going forward, in its current remit.

JH noted that unlike other groups, SIB has representatives of rights bearers as well as duty bearers and that it is important to have a constructive strategic space with representatives of both groups to have these conversations, working together.

JD’s Initial thoughts were that SIB carries a vital role in accountability and discussion of the issues at heart of UNCRC. She queried whether this could be expanded to include policy representatives within SG with responsibility for these issues so that we can consider a whole-govt and whole-society approach to implement UNCRC. LL responded, noting that we need to avoid duplication with the role of the Children and Families National Leadership Group.

Members all agreed that it would be helpful to have further time to consider these questions and feedback accordingly. As the next meeting will take place in November members would be invited to provide written feedback by the end of October.

ACTION: DS to email questions to members along with a written summary of groups mentioned by LL.

Risk register

Liz provided member with update on the programme risk register and changes. Members were invited comments or offer suggestions for further updates. None were raised at this time.

Any other business and close

Ian thanked all members for their engagement and contributions. The next meeting will take place Tuesday 26 November 2024.